Evil-minded parishioners making life hell for clergy

New CofE report, on the 'dark side' of church life with chapter by Rowan Williams. Cambridge religion psychologist Dr Sara Savage describes how parish priests are going down with Irritable Clergy Syndrome as faced with 'toxic mix' parishioners with neurotic and sometimes near-psychotic personality disorders trying to bully, manipulate and control.

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[Ted Cooper]

Evil-minded parishioners making life hell for clergy

As 'they' say "It takes two to tango." Parishioners should be up front with freeing the clergyman's wife from any expectations not common to the whole church. Clergy should be paid well, and be able to get away on time-off without feeling guilty. In return we expect the clergy to read and study in order to feed the congregation. Above all, I think the clergy should follow 1Cor. 4:2 "Now it is required that those who have been given a trust must prove faithful." (TNIV).

Having said that, we lay people and clergy must aspire to the same levels of faith and behaviour. We are in it together.

Church hopping? Faithful people want to attend faithful churches. Maybe some blessed subtractions along the lines of Wesley's successes are in order. (He was asked about the success of a recent trip, and instead of a glowing account of additions to the kingdom, he reported some blessed subtractions - if my memory is holding up.)

Ted

[alistair mcbay]

"we suffer from all the afflictions that atheists and agnostics and all other human beings suffer from - and we admit it."

Come on Keith - are you going to admit you suffer from one more affliction than us atheists, agnostics, humanists and brights, or do I need to spell it out for you?

I saw this conflict issue in my church when I was a callow youth in the fifties and sixties. Nothing new under the sun, then. I used to call it the "60-minute believer" problem - those for whom religious faith meant nothing more than an hour on a Sunday in a cold Kirk, dreading the sermon, longing to get home and marvelling at how her from No 21 had another new coat on while everybody knew she was behind with the rent. Outside that hour, loving one's neighbour didn't get a look-in, whether on church business or not. Still, it might explain why clergymen need to get 'bished as a newt' occasionally.....

I'm aware of the Haugk book the Rev Andy refers to above. Haugk discusses what motivates antagonists, and offers advice to counter their attacks. The key passage for me is this:

“Antagonists are individuals who, on the basis of nonsubstantial evidence, go out of their way to make insatiable demands"

Ah, that'll be religion he's talking about, then, and religious believers demanding ever more faith schools, for example!

Religion is nothing at all if it is not based on people making insatiable demands on the basis of nonsubstantial evidence - or non-existent evidence to be more exact! But I imagine the irony in the statement was lost entirely on its author.

[Julie]

Yes, (re:David's comment) it's likely to be 'six of one and half a dozen of the other' - but the clergy are paid to rise above it and to show mature leadership, not to put the metaphorical boot in if they find some people in the congregation don't want to sing from the same songsheet.

[David Booker]

Isn't the truth really that there are bullies in some pews and in some puipits - The laity and the clergy can play 'my horror story is worse than yours' endlessly because neither feel supported by the top leadership of the church when things get nasty. Bullies get away with it because leaders are full of 'concern' but take no meaningful action.

[Julie]

There is an edited extract on The Church Times website, and this is a small part of that:

Difficult people
I am informed that one of the most stressful features of ministry is the effort to be nice to “difficult people”. Defining others as difficult can be, of course, a projection of one’s own personality problems.

However, it is salutary to realise that according to the Diagnostic Statistical Manual IV (the manual that categorises the range of psychological disorders), there is a small portion of the population who, while not psychotic (in other words, they are in touch with reality) have developed inflexible, maladaptive personalities with a striking inability to reflect on their own need for change. Thus the clinical outlook for those afflicted is bleak.

People suffering from personality disorders often avoid social groups such as church. Yet people with a narcissistic personality disorder can in fact be attracted to the way a religious belief-system provides a pretext for self-righteousness and self-centredness.

Narcissists are marked by an inability to see another’s point of view. They can be charming and outwardly successful, but other people are not “real” for narcissists; they are objects that should conform to the narcissist’s “correct” point of view.

Ministerial selection processes usually manage to screen clergy in this regard, but no similar mechanism exists for screening lay volunteers. Given this lack of screening, at times the wrong people will get into influential positions in church.

Theological training rarely includes “handling difficult people” on the syllabus (although it should). Handling difficult people requires compassion and firm boundaries, as in one vicar’s pithy advice: “Form a real relationship with them, and then sit on them.”

‘It is not possible to shed the problems simply by starting new forms of Church’

The frailty of the over-generous parish system is all too evident, yet this vulnerability can also be seen as a mark of journeying with Christ. Given the rate of cultural change during the latter part of this journey, it is clear that a host of “fresh expressions” of Church is needed if the Church is to re-connect with culture.

However, it is not possible to shed the problems discussed here simply by starting new forms of Church. Embedded in the human condition as the negatives are, the dark side of Church will persist in fresh expressions, although this will not be evident until the honeymoon period is over.

We need to guard against fantasy solutions that make us think we can leave the current problems behind simply by creating new forms of Church (though this will be difficult enough). We need to learn from the social-psychological processes endemic in the parish system.

The positives of church life, in the face of church decline, are attended by a fear of loss, which results in constricted thinking. The harder people cling to the positives, the more exhausting are the conflicts produced by the negatives. Yet these negative features, while daunting, contain a germ of hope.

As a psychologist, I am sorely tempted to give advice. If the parish system could be condensed into a single “patient on the couch”, my advice would be:

• Stop clinging to the positives. Let them float on the water. What can survive, will survive.

• Face into the negatives. Develop the means to deal with them; use the resources that exist.

• Trust the process of change. Change is necessary and will occur whether it is welcomed or not. To welcome change is to trust that the Church always has been, and will continue to be, a wise householder bringing out treasures both old and new.

Sara Savage is a social psychologist and Senior Researcher with the Psychology and Religion Research Programme in Cambridge University.

This is an edited extract from The Future of the Parish System, edited by Steven Croft (Church House Publishing, £12.99; 0-7151-4034-5).

[Rev Andy]

I have seen this time and time again in churches, and experienced a dreadful time myself 5 years ago. What got me through it was a little book called Antagonists in the Church by Haugk. It's American but very very good and helps us see those who would destroy before they really get going. It suggests various policies and processes that mean that those who seek to destroy can't do so. I used the ideas in this book to rebuild our church.

[Obsculta]

Still a Rector of two small country villages, I suffer(ed) - as did/does my darling wife - tremendous abuse from a dozen or so evil-minded, "un-Christian" dare I say it?, power-crazy people, led by one vicious individual, when I returned from a 3-month much-needed sabbatical in 2000. These twelve could not have been more spiteful and hateful if they had tried. Not only did they thus treat me and my family, but - equally un-called for - also a good number of our PCC and congregation members. I remain for ever very humbly grateful for the tremendous support, love and encouragement I received from 99.9% of my parishioners and villagers, because without them, life would have been even more of a living hell than it already was! Having succeeded in severely, but without any foundation, damaging my good name and reputation, which - in turn - prevented me from ever moving to a different living (i.e., parish) or job from that moment, the 'dirty dozen' all moved to a neighbouring town to "worship". Sadly they all still live in the village and this means that the chances are that we bump into each other in the local post office, shop, or at village events, such as the recent Act of Remembrance at our village's War Memorial. The Diocesan Bishop, the then Area Bishop (now elevated to be a higher office), the incompetent Archdeacon, the Diocesan Communications' Officer and some other Diocesan Officers were all, without exception, more than absolutely useless! Words like "wall", "on" and "sitting" still spring to mind. "Lean back," said one Bishop, "and you will feel my hands supporting you..." - but if I had done so, then I would have ended up with a broken skull! In the meantime, I am sorry to admit that I cannot wait for my retirement... So much then for trying faithfully to live out a life-long vocation with true professionalism, compassion and pastoral sensitivity to my utmost ability, throughout my years as an Anglican priest. Not surprisingly perhaps, that I did not bother to celebrate the golden jubilee of my ordination last June. Roll on March 2015...

[Raspberry Rabbit]

I think of all the caricatures of clergy which appear in literature, films and on television. There's the evil scheming Catholic bishop trying to suppress the truth about foundational documents. There's the ranting Evangelical with the floppy Bible and the white shoes. There's the ridiculous chinless Anglican vicar being pursued by the buxom widow at the cocktail party. Having ministered in the core of a big city, in the far north of Canada and now in small town Scotland I can testify (at least from the POV of chinless Anglicans) that there are more heroes out there that one might think. The parish hall remains the place least likely to be closed down by some cost-cutting bean-counting bureaucrat and the vicar remains one of the few local resources which you don't need to take a means test to utilize. There remains, however, the perennial problem of the strong-minded contrary individual amongst the parishioners who believes that it is his or her right to control the affairs of the local church. They tell us that 'there's one in every church' and most of us with a few years under our belts can go through our scrapbooks and pick them out.

Over the next decades and in spite of the predictions of those at the Guardian who are not our friends - the local congregation and its vicar will become more important in the lives of people both within and outwith the Church. It behooves us, therefore, to learn how to care for nasty people within our congregation without necessarily handing them the reins - not only for the sake of the mental health of clergy but for the effectiveness of our work and mission.

[Julie]

To balance things out, just a bit - could we talk about 'toxic mix' clergy with neurotic and sometimes near-psychotic personality disorders trying to bully, manipulate and control? Well, no because that wouldn't benice. The accusatory attitudes towards parishioners seem sad and childish to me -more, it is embarrassing to read such public whining and whinging from professionals - people might lose respect. Clergy must know that they are going to come up against strong characters during the course of their ministry, and if they don't have the necessary skills to handle difficult people then perhaps they are in the wrong area of ministry.

I am married to a cleric - in twenty odds years, and in various parishes, we have not met an 'evil' parishioner (well just the one, who wanted to kill us, but who settled for stabbing the policemen who came to our aid, instead. I say he was 'evil' because he was judged to not be suffering from any mental disorder). Neuroticism and psychotic or near-psychotic personality disorders are not a sin - neither are psychotics evil,or necessarily, evil-minded. It may be sinful though, to demonise and to stigmatise those who have mental health problems, and that bit too cheap and easy for anyone to imply that those who upset the clergy are 'mental/mentals' - it is so offensive, so last century. I'd like to rant, but what's the point?

Still - good bait, and kudos. :-)

[Tim Cooper]

Keith: My posting was a little tongue in cheek, maybe even mischevious, and I could have predicted your reply! But, so far on this thread, some of the people participating in the life of the parish church, both clergy and laity are telling a sorry story. I agree that a few 'evil-minded' parishioners may not present a true picture overall. It might, for example, be much more widespread than that - and much worse! The article does not take fully into account the caring work that I am sure prevails in many church communities; such are the dangers of articles seemingly designed to present a story from one perspective.

On another level, if claims such as these are true, it does tend to support the non-faith view that rancour, dissent and disillusionment maybe as much a part of the parochial scene, as well as the grand public schisms and posturing that is widely reported on an international scale.

Much has been said recently in support of church schools. Equally, SORS has produced a robust defence of fundamental Christian 'values' together with the view that Christians may be compromised in their beliefs. Part of the reason that I do not agree with either rationale is because I believe that religious fervour, in whatever form, is firstly an unclear dimension that schoolchildren can do without and should not be introduced to, and also that faith groups ascribe an importance to themselves within society that they do not deserve and which does not necessarily represent a mainstream view over wider humanitarian issues.
Since much taxpayer's money is invested annually in the Church of England, perhaps an independent enquiry should investigate the extent of these claims of local disunity. You will of course say, I'm sure, that this would be a further waste of public money.

[Keith Downer]

Maybe, Tim, I am doing you a disservice but I must confess I am a little disappointed in you - although I must also admit that I am not quite sure what you are getting at?

Is this a confession that you judge all situations and all people on the actions and behaviour of one person which then leads to revelations about a small number of other people who experience stress and other problems related to the degree and intensity of their work?

I guarantee that for every clergyman or Christian involved in administration and Parish orientated responsibilities who could be descried by some of the criteria we are discussing here, there are countless others whose contribution and behaviour is beyond reproach.

[doug in colorado]

Ah, let's just do away with parishes...lock the bloody doors and send folks home. The Church is obviously not giving their flock what they need. When you try to be "relevant," hip, and politically correct, and throw the moral compass overboard, what's the point in going to church? What good does it do you? I'm a protestant who goes to a Catholic church...both those denominations still seem to remember that sin and evil are real, not relative, and both have their weaknesses and detractors, to be sure. Both are at least still holding their own in numbers or in fact growing, unlike the Church in England.

[Johnny]

I read Saturday's article with a sense of relief as the points raised were so true. I know what it is to live in constant terror in a parish for five years - to be caught in the middle of jealousies between power and status hungry women.I know what it is to be nice, to be loving, to be kind, to turn the other cheek time and time again - to try and live out the Gospel - and finally to have to admit defeat - before it killed me - because the people were just impossible. I have been unable to work now for 18 months and know that the vile behaviour I put up with nearly destroyed me emotionally, physically and spiritually.It was hell. I thank God I still had the strength to walk away.

[Jill]

Pity the poor clergy, many of whom do a wonderful job in far from fruitful corners of the vineyard. I would not like to take on some of the tasks they undertake. Curates are becoming an endangered species in many churches; so many priests battle on alone with only voluntary support.

In my lifetime of churchgoing in many different churches I have witnessed a number of incidents like the ones described, but I have also seen some insensitive or downright arrogant moves by clergy themselves which bring about dissent - I have been part of a church where a new vicar has come along, and within five minutes of being in post has sacked the choir and organist and brought out the guitars and the rock band, then wondered why people got upset. Others have made sweeping reforms which perhaps have been correct liturgically or theologically but have been done without consulting the people actually involved. There are ways and ways of doing things, so perhaps it is unfair to pin the whole blame on the parishioners.

As an aside, we Brits are deeply traditional – this can surely be seen from the fact that cathedrals are having to lay on extra services for the numbers who are expected this Christmas. My guess is that this is because they can be assured of having a proper service, the like of which has all but disappeared in the parish churches. By this I mean the stirring language of Cranmer and the King James Bible, in all their richness, and proper Christmas carols with words that actually mean something, and freedom from the fear of a group hug.

[Tim Cooper]

What an ecumenical disaster! What an own goal! Recent postings on other blogs have seemingly entered the realms of myths and legends by painting Christians as wholly tolerant. Now, according to the Rev. Scott and others, some vicars are gloomy, with a degree of built in obsolescence through the divided loyalties of their 'psychotic and vicious' parishioners. 'Burnout, 'stress', 'emotionally drained', a 'toxic mix' of disordered personalities, 'treating people as objects', 'a low level of job satisfaction', the perception that the clergy is weak, uncommitted and lazy', 'worse than non-christians; the bishop allegedly a drunken, mendacious tyrant? I can scarcely believe my eyes. Is this the sort of institution that we should be promoting in our schools? Are these the same people that wish to be taken seriously over wider social issues and who want their faith to be protected against false accusations of bigotry? Christians are only human after all?..... Keith?

[Elizaphanian]

This seems very real to me (and the contributors are of very high calibre). I have adopted a motto to tide me through: "If you meet George Herbert on the road, kill him" - the 'George Herbert' model of ministry, if it was ever valid, is a recipe for clergy suicide today.

The motto keeps me just about on the side of sanity (see here).

[Revd John Scott]

AS a Vicar of 33 years experience I can honestly say I have tried to be "nice" it is simply not in my nature. I have always tried to be professional, and recognise that when you are given a Parish to work in, you can only do so much with the personalities you inherit. Furthermore, When you first arrive, the group you meet are probably a mixture of the disafected who did not like the last Vicar, but have now returned to see if you will do what they like. This can upset those who remained or were loyal to the person before. So you start with a personality clash not of your own making.
As we do not pay the officers of the Parish, it is hard to remove them without a huge fight, usually with local press headlines.
So one has to tread carfully.

rg writes: Thank you for this John, and to the others who have commented. I am just making this note to welcome you and the others to the weblog, it is always lovely when new people feel inspired to add to the interesting debates that take place here.

[Julie]

Another way of looking at it might be that Dr Savage is paranoid - maybe it goes with the territory. Is that her real name, or was it made up to complement her contribution to the book? I'd like to read it but there is no way I am paying £12.99 to be annoyed by a psychologist who has issues.

___________

The 'official' description of the book is a bit more prosaic -I got this from the CofE website:
__________

Reflecting on the future of the parish system
7 December 2006

The parish system of the Church of England is examined in a new book published today featuring 12 leading thinkers. Including contributions from the Archbishop of Canterbury and the Bishops of Peterborough and Maidstone, The Future of the Parish System discusses the challenges facing the parish system, and suggests principles for future development and growth.

Presented in three sections – Understanding our Context, Theological Resources, and Ways Forward – the collection of essays forms the latest in the Explorations series, a growing library of books that aim to stimulate debate within the church.

In the first section, Martyn Percy takes an historical perspective on the changing identity of the English parish church, while Sara Savage analyses the parish system from a psychological perspective, and sociologist Grace Davie charts the changing patterns of religious affiliation and activity in Northern Europe.

Theological reflections are led by the Archbishop of Canterbury, Dr Rowan Williams, who highlights some resources for re-examining church; the Rt Revd Graham Cray, Bishop of Maidstone, who reflects on how to focus church life on a theology of mission; and Steven Croft, who looks at changing patterns of mission in a “mixed-economy Church”.

Much of the book identifies principles for future development and growth. Robin Gamble outlines how to “do traditional church really well”, while the Rt Revd Ian Cundy, Bishop of Peterborough, gives an overview of the experience of dioceses which have reconfigured themselves for mission. Ann Morisy, Michael Moynagh and George Lings each explore how the Church can capture the experience of emerging forms of church, support the growth of these churches into maturity, and integrate them with more traditional churches. Finally, John Rees explores the potential of the proposed Dioceses, Mission and Ministry Measure in a chapter on the legal aspects of developing new forms of church.

The Future of the Parish System – Shaping the Church of England for the 21st Century is published by Church House Publishing, priced £12.99, and is available from Christian bookshops including Church House Bookshop, 31 Great Smith Street, London SW1P 3BN, tel. 020 7799 4064, email bookshop@chbookshop.co.uk, or on the web (mail order available).

[John]

Yes, it happens in the non-established churches too, and probably there is a correlation between the degree of evangelical fervour and the proportion of psychotic individuals in the membership. I wonder if any studies have been done in that area? I have personal experience of pastors and church leaders being harrassed and hounded out of office by a minority of vocal and, frankly, vicious individuals. Their behaviour has been worse than any I've seen in the 'non-Christian' world outside church, and has left me and others seriously questioning the faith that we and they claim to share. 'Niceness' was not the problem - it was how to provide pastoral care to people whose antagonism and sheer hatred made it impossible to do so.

[Christopher Salter]

And it's worse than that. Some of the clergy who survive in this awful setting behave as oddly as the parishioners. For an amazing example, which has never been resolved, go to the website www.answertoslander.homestead.com - it even involves the Bishop of Southwark again.

[Revd Dr Douglas Turton]

Thank you for your article. It reinforces the reality that many do not want to accept, that clergy are subject to stress that is serious enough to cause burnout. As a result of stress from parishioners clergy end up being emotionally drained, treat people as objects and have a low level of job satisfaction. My I commend to you the next edition of MENTAL HEALTH, RELIGION AND CULTURE No 10 (Jan 2007), a special edition, which focuses on clergy stress. There are some aspects of clergy lives that can offset stress e.g. prayer, but for many not only do they have their parishioners to contend with but also the hierarchy.

[Keith Downer]

As someone who has, in the past, has his fair share of PCC's, magazine committees, flower arranging ladies, church restoration funds and the like, these comments strike a strong chord.
I have experienced the full spectrum of religious atmosphere from sparsely attended Sunday services in cold, damp, decrepit naves, through rented school halls full of fervent, shrieking, arm-waving believers to powerful, well-organised evangelical establishments - one of which, in Brentwood, even had an old, 2nd World War anti-aircraft gun mounted by the gate!
I can understand the ineffectiveness of a "nice" vicar but I can also understand the divisive, manipulative machinations of those people who take an active part in church administration as either an outlet for their frustrated ambitions or to ensure that the status-quo is maintained. In my experience, the main body of the congregation (always supposing there are enough people to justify the description of a "main body") fluctuates between these two extremes depending on the issue and the time of year and the minister is stranded, in the middle.
Christians are, after all, only people. "If you prick us do we not bleed? If you tickle us do we not laugh? If you poison us do we not die?" It is the last part of that Shakespearean insight where we aim to be different; "And if you wrong us, shall we not revenge?" What else do you expect when "turning the other cheek" is a valued attribute?
You see, contrary to what many contributors to this blog would have you believe, we are "nice" people; nice, tolerant, respectful, forgiving, caring - but not all the time! We make mistakes, we get it wrong, we suffer from all the afflictions that atheists and agnostics and all other human beings suffer from - and we admit it.
The clergy, on the other hand, they are expected to be nice all the time; they can be preaching from the pulpit, holding the hand of a sick person in an hospital bed, giving confirmation classes to a group of young people who would rather be watching Eastenders or standing beside an open grave, on a cold, wet January morning, trying to comfort bereaved relatives. It would be a challenge to even the most devout and industrious of priests to fulfil those responsibilities, day in and day out and still retain sufficient energy and focus to administer fully and completely to their congregation.
Yet, in this day and age, being nice all the time is counterproductive. There has to be some backbone, a rod of steel forged from our faith and belief in Christ. But because men and women of faith tend to be reluctant to confront or antagonise their detractors - those who ridicule, disbelieve, use sarcasm, cynicism or downright mischievous misrepresentation in order to suffocate differing views - some clergy can be perceived as weak, uncommitted or even lazy.
It is therefore up to the leaders of the church, those at the top, to examine and monitor the degree to which "niceness" should be tempered with resoluteness, standing firm and determined to remain steadfastly on the path that Christ trod, with no meandering off the track when confronted with those who seek to undermine His teaching.

[Stephen A Blakey]

Excellent article which highlights one of the major challenges to the church. We end up investing so many of our resources to keep everyone happy we have nothing left to do the real work of the Gospel.

Applies as much to the Kirk in Scotland as to the CofE.

If people in business, education, private sector etc behaved like church people, their organisations would very quickly crumble in disarry!